OBOW Light Travel Forum > If I can only buy 1 bag for one bagging...?
What about the Tom Bihn Brain Bag? It seems to meet most of your requirements:
http://www.tombihn.com/backpacks/TB0104.html
http://www.tombihn.com/backpacks/TB0104.html
March 28, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
Hi JJ:
I, too, am a college professor and I agree with Frank. Sounds like the Tom Bihn Brain Bag is the one.
I, too, am a college professor and I agree with Frank. Sounds like the Tom Bihn Brain Bag is the one.
March 28, 2013 |
Alan
Alan
HI JJ-
In my opinion, if you want a very durable bag for the long haul, you want to:
1- Avoid zippers
2- Avoid excess "features."
3- Get something simple, with high-quality fabric.
I've been using the same backpack for travel since 1986, with several trips around the world and what amounts to several years of continuous use. It is a Lowe internal-frame backpack, which carries about 35-40 liters and weighs about 1500 grams (3.3 pounds).
It has one main top-loading drawstring compartment, two side pockets (with metal zippers), and one top pocket (also with a zipper) that cinches down the main compartment with two fastex buckles. It has a real waistband, a sternum strap, and an internal frame. It has a carry handle on top, and that's it. No ice-ax loops, no other compression straps, no gew-gaws. Ten or fifteen years ago, the urethane coating flaked off of the inside of the heavy cordura nylon over a period of a couple of years, as it will do. Now it isn't waterproof, but no problems. I use heavy plastic bags as the internal organizers anyway, so everything is protected from water.
If I'm using this bag, I'll also carry a simple daypack, which I'll pack inside the main bag. If I wanted to carry a laptop or an ipad, I'd get a dedicated foam case for the particular item, then slide it into the main pack just next to the internal frame. IMHO, if you get a back that already has some sort of foam armor for electronics, then-
1- you will always carry that excess weight, whether you need it or not, and
2- it may or may not fit whatever device you have in the future.
For instance, I've got an Eddy Bauer messenger bag that has a laptop sleeve. This bag weighs 814 grams and has one strap. My plain-vanilla daypack has two straps for symmetrical carry, has larger capacity, weighs 403 grams, and can be rolled up if you want to carry it empty in a larger bag.
A question for you- were you planning on wearing this bag on your back for the bike commute? The reason I ask is the following- a good backpack will have a frame. If whatever bag you get doesn't have a frame (or something that makes it rigid), then it won't be able to transfer weight to the waist belt. For instance, if you have a duffel bag with a waist belt, the waist belt might be useful for stabilizing the bag, but it will do nothing to get the weight off your shoulders and onto your hips, where the weight is much more easily borne. On a bike however, things are different. Ideally, you won't carry anything at all on your back, but rather in panniers, basket, saddlebag- whatever. You back stays cooler, you have less weight on your hands and shoulders. But, a daypack-sized bag isn't the end of the world. However if you want to wear a backpack with a frame while you're riding a bike, you'll find it to be quite uncomfortable. My commute to school is relatively short, about three miles each way. I have a pair of panniers and a rear rack. I carry my books in a daypack. The daypack goes into one pannier, and my cable and U-lock goes into the other pannier. When I get to school, I pull the locks out to lock the bike, and then pull the daypack out and head to my destination. So, I would suggest, whether or not you at some point want to get some sort of on-bike carrying system, that you consider your daypack your school pack rather than your travel pack. If that's feasible, that is- you may have to lug to much on your commute. You want a frame for your larger pack, and that frame is going to disqualify the larger pack from being what you would actually want to wear on your back while riding your bike.
You haven't said too much about the size bag you want, but looking at the bags you mention, it seems you're looking at around 35- 40 liters. I think that's a good size.
I don't have any particular bag recommendations- I haven't found anything exactly like my old Lowe backpack. The straps on the Sky Train look seriously lacking. The Brain Bag looks overbuilt for a daypack and underbuilt for a main bag. The Tri Star looks decent enough, I suppose (you think that thing has enough zippers?), but I'm not sure that would be your bag for Africa.
One thing you might do is to see what is available from REI. Their warranty is quite good. Another benefit is that if you have to take them up on something, it is easier to walk in and get an on-the-spot repair than it is to try to mail your bag back to somewhere else for warranty work or replacement.
Maybe the Osprey Porter 46?
http://www.rei.com/product/837012/osprey-porter-46-travel-pack
I haven't used it, and can't speak to how it carries as a backpack.
Hope you find this helpful!
John
Boulder, CO
In my opinion, if you want a very durable bag for the long haul, you want to:
1- Avoid zippers
2- Avoid excess "features."
3- Get something simple, with high-quality fabric.
I've been using the same backpack for travel since 1986, with several trips around the world and what amounts to several years of continuous use. It is a Lowe internal-frame backpack, which carries about 35-40 liters and weighs about 1500 grams (3.3 pounds).
It has one main top-loading drawstring compartment, two side pockets (with metal zippers), and one top pocket (also with a zipper) that cinches down the main compartment with two fastex buckles. It has a real waistband, a sternum strap, and an internal frame. It has a carry handle on top, and that's it. No ice-ax loops, no other compression straps, no gew-gaws. Ten or fifteen years ago, the urethane coating flaked off of the inside of the heavy cordura nylon over a period of a couple of years, as it will do. Now it isn't waterproof, but no problems. I use heavy plastic bags as the internal organizers anyway, so everything is protected from water.
If I'm using this bag, I'll also carry a simple daypack, which I'll pack inside the main bag. If I wanted to carry a laptop or an ipad, I'd get a dedicated foam case for the particular item, then slide it into the main pack just next to the internal frame. IMHO, if you get a back that already has some sort of foam armor for electronics, then-
1- you will always carry that excess weight, whether you need it or not, and
2- it may or may not fit whatever device you have in the future.
For instance, I've got an Eddy Bauer messenger bag that has a laptop sleeve. This bag weighs 814 grams and has one strap. My plain-vanilla daypack has two straps for symmetrical carry, has larger capacity, weighs 403 grams, and can be rolled up if you want to carry it empty in a larger bag.
A question for you- were you planning on wearing this bag on your back for the bike commute? The reason I ask is the following- a good backpack will have a frame. If whatever bag you get doesn't have a frame (or something that makes it rigid), then it won't be able to transfer weight to the waist belt. For instance, if you have a duffel bag with a waist belt, the waist belt might be useful for stabilizing the bag, but it will do nothing to get the weight off your shoulders and onto your hips, where the weight is much more easily borne. On a bike however, things are different. Ideally, you won't carry anything at all on your back, but rather in panniers, basket, saddlebag- whatever. You back stays cooler, you have less weight on your hands and shoulders. But, a daypack-sized bag isn't the end of the world. However if you want to wear a backpack with a frame while you're riding a bike, you'll find it to be quite uncomfortable. My commute to school is relatively short, about three miles each way. I have a pair of panniers and a rear rack. I carry my books in a daypack. The daypack goes into one pannier, and my cable and U-lock goes into the other pannier. When I get to school, I pull the locks out to lock the bike, and then pull the daypack out and head to my destination. So, I would suggest, whether or not you at some point want to get some sort of on-bike carrying system, that you consider your daypack your school pack rather than your travel pack. If that's feasible, that is- you may have to lug to much on your commute. You want a frame for your larger pack, and that frame is going to disqualify the larger pack from being what you would actually want to wear on your back while riding your bike.
You haven't said too much about the size bag you want, but looking at the bags you mention, it seems you're looking at around 35- 40 liters. I think that's a good size.
I don't have any particular bag recommendations- I haven't found anything exactly like my old Lowe backpack. The straps on the Sky Train look seriously lacking. The Brain Bag looks overbuilt for a daypack and underbuilt for a main bag. The Tri Star looks decent enough, I suppose (you think that thing has enough zippers?), but I'm not sure that would be your bag for Africa.
One thing you might do is to see what is available from REI. Their warranty is quite good. Another benefit is that if you have to take them up on something, it is easier to walk in and get an on-the-spot repair than it is to try to mail your bag back to somewhere else for warranty work or replacement.
Maybe the Osprey Porter 46?
http://www.rei.com/product/837012/osprey-porter-46-travel-pack
I haven't used it, and can't speak to how it carries as a backpack.
Hope you find this helpful!
John
Boulder, CO
March 28, 2013 |
John
John
Thanks for the quick and helpful responses. You all are defiitely helping me rethink this; I've been focused on bags that can be carried three different ways and thus haven't been looking at backpacks. I've been using a backpack for the commute and a shoulder strapped bag that also has a handle while at school, so something with a shoulder strap has been stuck in my brain. I suppose there are occasions when I would like or might need the a little more professional look than the backpack provides, but I'll have to think that through.
John, I carry the pack on my back. I don't have a rack or panniers. I might end up biking Missouri's Katy Trail in its entirety in a couple of years, and if so will need to make an investment in that direction. I think you are nailing the size I believe I need.
If the bike commute was taken out of the equation (or the need to carry the pack on my back was), would you go with the framed pack or something that includes the option of a shoulder strap?
Thanks again to all. Much appreciated. JJ
John, I carry the pack on my back. I don't have a rack or panniers. I might end up biking Missouri's Katy Trail in its entirety in a couple of years, and if so will need to make an investment in that direction. I think you are nailing the size I believe I need.
If the bike commute was taken out of the equation (or the need to carry the pack on my back was), would you go with the framed pack or something that includes the option of a shoulder strap?
Thanks again to all. Much appreciated. JJ
March 28, 2013 |
JJ
JJ
The problem, JJ, is you want a "one size fits all bag" and it doesn't exist.
A full size, carry-on bag is way too big for a daily commute for what you need to carry. An internal frame is really not necessary unless you plan to do some serious backpacking.
Instead of looking at the most expensive bags, why not split it in two: Get one carry-on and one every day carry (EDC).
For carry-on, how about these:
MEI Voyageur ($139)
L.L. Bean Quickload Travel Pack ($129)
Both are very well made and will last awhile. If you're only taking 2-3 trips a year, and you don't plan to drag these bags through the mud, you can easily get years of use out of them.
You also seem to be partial to three compartment bags over one compartment bags. Is there a reason for this?
A full size, carry-on bag is way too big for a daily commute for what you need to carry. An internal frame is really not necessary unless you plan to do some serious backpacking.
Instead of looking at the most expensive bags, why not split it in two: Get one carry-on and one every day carry (EDC).
For carry-on, how about these:
MEI Voyageur ($139)
L.L. Bean Quickload Travel Pack ($129)
Both are very well made and will last awhile. If you're only taking 2-3 trips a year, and you don't plan to drag these bags through the mud, you can easily get years of use out of them.
You also seem to be partial to three compartment bags over one compartment bags. Is there a reason for this?
March 28, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
<<a "one size fits all bag" ...doesn't exist.>>
So as Frank points out, probably what you need is one bag at the upper limits of "carry-on" then another at the upper limits of "personal," the latter used for "every day carry," but also supplementing the other bag for travel, and allowing you to take TWO bags without checking.The smaller bag probably ought to be "cross shoulder" carry, as you can't really wear two backpacks at once.
So, a Patagonia Half Mass Courier Bag might be the smaller bag, or perhaps the Osprey Ozone Courier Bag, both $89, coupled with an Osprey Porter 46, $99, total investment $188, but with timely buying you might spend less. Regardless, for a long term investment, handling each bag in person will help you decide.
Finally for some of the trips, a "travel vest" might add to your totable total.
So as Frank points out, probably what you need is one bag at the upper limits of "carry-on" then another at the upper limits of "personal," the latter used for "every day carry," but also supplementing the other bag for travel, and allowing you to take TWO bags without checking.The smaller bag probably ought to be "cross shoulder" carry, as you can't really wear two backpacks at once.
So, a Patagonia Half Mass Courier Bag might be the smaller bag, or perhaps the Osprey Ozone Courier Bag, both $89, coupled with an Osprey Porter 46, $99, total investment $188, but with timely buying you might spend less. Regardless, for a long term investment, handling each bag in person will help you decide.
Finally for some of the trips, a "travel vest" might add to your totable total.
March 29, 2013 |
Alan B
Alan B
-----------If the bike commute was taken out of the equation (or the need to carry the pack on my back was), would you go with the framed pack or something that includes the option of a shoulder strap?--------
YMMV, but I favor a backpack, no question. Forget "hike all day"scenarios, just think of getting on and off and plane and getting to ground transportation. Getting on the plane, with a backpack, the bag is centered. You walk down the aisle and you don't have to hold the bag away from the sides where it will hit people. Get off the plane, and you've got a ten or fifteen minute walk through the airport. I'd rather do that walk with a bag with the weight, heavy or light, on my hips, rather than just on one shoulder.
And, as far as two bags go, if I've got a second smaller bag for day trips, that bag goes INSIDE the larger bag. That's another reason I like top loading bags with a drawstring- just stuff your second bag in on top (no need to empty it), and crank down the fastex buckles to keep it all secure and tight. Zippers are usually less happy with lumpy loads.
I think part of the rap on backpacks is the strappiness, and that is a concern. If you're walking down that airport aisle and you've got straps and flaps and elastic gew-gaws with cinch straps and dangly things everywhere, that's not so good. But simpler backpacks are out there, just have to look.
The other thing, as others have noted, is that with a backpack, it helps to try one on in person. Get the salesperson to adjust it for you, see how it carries weight etc. etc.
John
YMMV, but I favor a backpack, no question. Forget "hike all day"scenarios, just think of getting on and off and plane and getting to ground transportation. Getting on the plane, with a backpack, the bag is centered. You walk down the aisle and you don't have to hold the bag away from the sides where it will hit people. Get off the plane, and you've got a ten or fifteen minute walk through the airport. I'd rather do that walk with a bag with the weight, heavy or light, on my hips, rather than just on one shoulder.
And, as far as two bags go, if I've got a second smaller bag for day trips, that bag goes INSIDE the larger bag. That's another reason I like top loading bags with a drawstring- just stuff your second bag in on top (no need to empty it), and crank down the fastex buckles to keep it all secure and tight. Zippers are usually less happy with lumpy loads.
I think part of the rap on backpacks is the strappiness, and that is a concern. If you're walking down that airport aisle and you've got straps and flaps and elastic gew-gaws with cinch straps and dangly things everywhere, that's not so good. But simpler backpacks are out there, just have to look.
The other thing, as others have noted, is that with a backpack, it helps to try one on in person. Get the salesperson to adjust it for you, see how it carries weight etc. etc.
John
March 29, 2013 |
John
John
John, you're leaving out an entire category--convertible bags. These are bags where the backpack straps hide away. Those are what are very popular here and what we suggest for carry-on travel. With these bags, you have a choice of wearing it as a backpack, using a shoulder strap, or carrying it by its handle.
So when I say he doesn't need a backpack, I'm talking about a true backpack where there are no other choices of carrying it.
So when I say he doesn't need a backpack, I'm talking about a true backpack where there are no other choices of carrying it.
March 29, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
John's comment that:
<<as far as two bags go, if I've got a second smaller bag for day trips, that bag goes INSIDE the larger bag.>>
eliminates for the second bag the Osprey Ozone or Patagonia Half-Mass courier bags I suggested, as well as the Tom Bihn Ego, with mention that the Half Mass actually exceeds the typical 36 inch total L+W+D for a personal item, BUT surely he might want to consider either the Medium or especially, the Large Tom Bihn Cafe Bag, perhaps including an iPad Cache, more likely in Dyneema than the Cordura, a total investment of $110 including the shipping, dimensions of the Large:
Dimensions: 13.3" x 12.9" x 3.3" / 340 x 330 x 85 mm
Weights:
Cordura, with shoulder strap: 20.2 oz / 575 grams
Dyneema/nylon, with shoulder strap: 16.5 oz / 470 grams
Volume: 675 cubic inches / 11 liters (ASTM Standard Measure)
1.5" / 38 mm shoulder strap extends to 54" / 1.3 m
Removable 1" / 25 mm waist strap included
whose width should still allow a snug fit inside most of the "converrtible" bags to which Frank refers. The total investment when coupled with an Osprey Porter 46 remains around $220, total weight of the bags around four pounds. Hope-fully Frank will concur with the concept of INVESTMENT, i.e., by making the choices correctly the first time without getting hung up on cost issues, over the long run there is greater VALUE to the combination.
<<as far as two bags go, if I've got a second smaller bag for day trips, that bag goes INSIDE the larger bag.>>
eliminates for the second bag the Osprey Ozone or Patagonia Half-Mass courier bags I suggested, as well as the Tom Bihn Ego, with mention that the Half Mass actually exceeds the typical 36 inch total L+W+D for a personal item, BUT surely he might want to consider either the Medium or especially, the Large Tom Bihn Cafe Bag, perhaps including an iPad Cache, more likely in Dyneema than the Cordura, a total investment of $110 including the shipping, dimensions of the Large:
Dimensions: 13.3" x 12.9" x 3.3" / 340 x 330 x 85 mm
Weights:
Cordura, with shoulder strap: 20.2 oz / 575 grams
Dyneema/nylon, with shoulder strap: 16.5 oz / 470 grams
Volume: 675 cubic inches / 11 liters (ASTM Standard Measure)
1.5" / 38 mm shoulder strap extends to 54" / 1.3 m
Removable 1" / 25 mm waist strap included
whose width should still allow a snug fit inside most of the "converrtible" bags to which Frank refers. The total investment when coupled with an Osprey Porter 46 remains around $220, total weight of the bags around four pounds. Hope-fully Frank will concur with the concept of INVESTMENT, i.e., by making the choices correctly the first time without getting hung up on cost issues, over the long run there is greater VALUE to the combination.
March 29, 2013 |
Alan B
Alan B
---------John, you're leaving out an entire category--convertible bags. These are bags where the backpack straps hide away. Those are what are very popular here and what we suggest for carry-on travel. With these bags, you have a choice of wearing it as a backpack, using a shoulder strap, or carrying it by its handle. So when I say he doesn't need a backpack, I'm talking about a true backpack where there are no other choices of carrying it.-----------------
That's a good point. I'm not ruling out convertible bags entirely, it's just that in my experience, it is more important to have good waist belt/shoulder straps/stiffener than it is that those zip away. In other words, better a backpack-backpack with good load carrying than a convertible with vestigial shoulder straps that don't do much, IMHO and YMMV. I don't have enough experience with convertible bags to speak to the efficacy of their backpack straps.
That's a good point. I'm not ruling out convertible bags entirely, it's just that in my experience, it is more important to have good waist belt/shoulder straps/stiffener than it is that those zip away. In other words, better a backpack-backpack with good load carrying than a convertible with vestigial shoulder straps that don't do much, IMHO and YMMV. I don't have enough experience with convertible bags to speak to the efficacy of their backpack straps.
March 29, 2013 |
John
John
"That's a good point. I'm not ruling out convertible bags entirely, it's just that in my experience, it is more important to have good waist belt/shoulder straps/stiffener than it is that those zip away. In other words, better a backpack-backpack with good load carrying than a convertible with vestigial shoulder straps that don't do much, IMHO and YMMV. I don't have enough experience with convertible bags to speak to the efficacy of their backpack straps."
For the average use of a convertible bag---while walking through an airport terminal or train station, a short distance in a city to a hotel, or other fairly short distances--it's not going to make a big difference unless the bag is way over packed. Many convertible bags come with waist straps or sternum straps as well. And most importantly, when traveling for business, it doesn't always look good to walk into a hotel or office carrying a large backpack. With the hideaway backpack straps, the bag turns into something looking slightly more 'businesslike."
A good rule of thumb is to never carry more than 10% of your weight on your back with a convertible bag. If you carry more, or plan to carry the bag for hours on end, then it may be necessary to look into more advanced backpack/support systems.
Most of the better designed convertible bags have well padded, ergonomically designed backpack straps that do a very good job.
For the average use of a convertible bag---while walking through an airport terminal or train station, a short distance in a city to a hotel, or other fairly short distances--it's not going to make a big difference unless the bag is way over packed. Many convertible bags come with waist straps or sternum straps as well. And most importantly, when traveling for business, it doesn't always look good to walk into a hotel or office carrying a large backpack. With the hideaway backpack straps, the bag turns into something looking slightly more 'businesslike."
A good rule of thumb is to never carry more than 10% of your weight on your back with a convertible bag. If you carry more, or plan to carry the bag for hours on end, then it may be necessary to look into more advanced backpack/support systems.
Most of the better designed convertible bags have well padded, ergonomically designed backpack straps that do a very good job.
March 29, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
I've got an L.L. Bean Quickload and it works very well for airplane , train or boats. It's comfortable for about 45 minutes then it gets uncomfortable. The straps are fairly comfortable but it doesn't have a waist belt. I carry a Rick Steves Civita day bag when I'm in town. I'd love to travel with an MEI Voyager but I prefer the lighter weight of the Quickload. That's just me and each of us has to find what works for them. Good luck on your search.
March 29, 2013 |
Larry
Larry
I don't think anyone has commented on the Tri Star yet. I have one which my husband uses, mostly. It is a fantastically well-made bag. I have read the concerns expressed by a reviewer about the rubber in the zips but there is certainly no sign of that problem on my bag (and I would think it very unlikely, personally). It is a good size for the range of uses you have outlined, except that it might not handle an expanded packing list for your projected Africa trips. But you could always supplement it with a cheaper personal bag in that situation. If you get it in a conservative colour it looks perfectly appropriate in a business casual environment (sort of like an oversized laptop bag).
Personally I think Tom Bihn is worth the money - I was happy to pay the hefty cost of shipping mine to Australia. Good luck with your decision.
Personally I think Tom Bihn is worth the money - I was happy to pay the hefty cost of shipping mine to Australia. Good luck with your decision.
March 31, 2013 |
JL
JL
Thanks to all for the input/insights. A quick update and a few responses to issues that surfaced above.
First, the update. Since I last posted, I've gained access to a Swiss Gear laptop back pack and also a decent Eddie Bauer messenger bag. Now I've got the ability to either handle the bike commute and on campus needs with one of these bags, or sell the Swiss Gear back and use it toward an exceptional bag that more directly targets my other needs. In some ways, this complicates the decision.
Now for the responses:
1. Frank, I'm used to two or three compartment bags from the era when I flew more regularly and needed a laptop more consistently. Thus I probably defaulted in that direction. I was also thinking this might enable me to avoid packing cubes while still keeping my clothes less wrinkled, but that might not be accurate or realistic. And, since at the time of my original email I was thinking about just one bag, I thought the sections would make it easier for when I did need to tote a laptop (since I could use the central section of the bag for that and leave the other sections empty). Of course, your suggestions and the possibility of keeping the Swiss Gear/Bauer bag now have me thinking in other directions.
2. Now, I need to decide if I should sell the Swiss Gear bag and use the $ toward the cost of something else (while keeping the Bauer messenger back for on-campus stuff). Is the quality difference and greater flexibility of the Brain Bag worth the cost differential? I don't know the model of the Swiss Gear bag, but it has 2 major compartments, built in laptop sleeve various other external and internal dividers, etc. But, it isn't good for packing clothes so it won't make the best one bagger.
3. Thinking seriously about pursuing the Voyageur. I really like the idea of a convertible and this bag has more appeal now that I'm warming to the possibility of packing cubes. Under those circumstances I would want to pack a day bag for the Europe trips, especially. Part of me still likes the idea of a Red Oxx bag because of the Africa trips, but it sounds like the Voyageur is made well and I'm not impressed with the shoulder straps on the SkyTrain.
Suggestions in light of these developments?
JJ
First, the update. Since I last posted, I've gained access to a Swiss Gear laptop back pack and also a decent Eddie Bauer messenger bag. Now I've got the ability to either handle the bike commute and on campus needs with one of these bags, or sell the Swiss Gear back and use it toward an exceptional bag that more directly targets my other needs. In some ways, this complicates the decision.
Now for the responses:
1. Frank, I'm used to two or three compartment bags from the era when I flew more regularly and needed a laptop more consistently. Thus I probably defaulted in that direction. I was also thinking this might enable me to avoid packing cubes while still keeping my clothes less wrinkled, but that might not be accurate or realistic. And, since at the time of my original email I was thinking about just one bag, I thought the sections would make it easier for when I did need to tote a laptop (since I could use the central section of the bag for that and leave the other sections empty). Of course, your suggestions and the possibility of keeping the Swiss Gear/Bauer bag now have me thinking in other directions.
2. Now, I need to decide if I should sell the Swiss Gear bag and use the $ toward the cost of something else (while keeping the Bauer messenger back for on-campus stuff). Is the quality difference and greater flexibility of the Brain Bag worth the cost differential? I don't know the model of the Swiss Gear bag, but it has 2 major compartments, built in laptop sleeve various other external and internal dividers, etc. But, it isn't good for packing clothes so it won't make the best one bagger.
3. Thinking seriously about pursuing the Voyageur. I really like the idea of a convertible and this bag has more appeal now that I'm warming to the possibility of packing cubes. Under those circumstances I would want to pack a day bag for the Europe trips, especially. Part of me still likes the idea of a Red Oxx bag because of the Africa trips, but it sounds like the Voyageur is made well and I'm not impressed with the shoulder straps on the SkyTrain.
Suggestions in light of these developments?
JJ
April 2, 2013 |
JJ
JJ
You do realize that the Sky Train and the Voyageur are made of the same material--1000d Codura Nylon. Both also use YKK zippers.
The Voyageur has a better backpack system and is about $100 less. It's bigger but weighs less, , has an external compressions system and can hold more. They will also customize a bag for you.
The Sky Train has a lifetime guarantee against anything. The Voyageur's lifetime guarantee is only for manufacturing defects.
I don't own either, but if I was in your situation, I'd go with the Voyageur. (Well, actually, I wouldn't take either bag, but if I had to choose from those two, I'd go with the Voyageur. If I could choose any bag it would be the Tom Bihn Aeronaut.)
And when it comes to packing cubes, I suggest the Eagle Creek Specter line of cubes and folders. they are ultra lightweight and come in numerous sizes:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005SKJ53K?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creativeASIN=B005SKJ53K&linkCode=xm2&tag=ibssupportgroupf
Here's a review I did of them:
http://www.1bag1world.com/blog/2012/12/8/gear-review-eagle-creek-specter-pack-it-packing-solutions.html
The Voyageur has a better backpack system and is about $100 less. It's bigger but weighs less, , has an external compressions system and can hold more. They will also customize a bag for you.
The Sky Train has a lifetime guarantee against anything. The Voyageur's lifetime guarantee is only for manufacturing defects.
I don't own either, but if I was in your situation, I'd go with the Voyageur. (Well, actually, I wouldn't take either bag, but if I had to choose from those two, I'd go with the Voyageur. If I could choose any bag it would be the Tom Bihn Aeronaut.)
And when it comes to packing cubes, I suggest the Eagle Creek Specter line of cubes and folders. they are ultra lightweight and come in numerous sizes:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005SKJ53K?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creativeASIN=B005SKJ53K&linkCode=xm2&tag=ibssupportgroupf
Here's a review I did of them:
http://www.1bag1world.com/blog/2012/12/8/gear-review-eagle-creek-specter-pack-it-packing-solutions.html
April 2, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
Frank, could you briefly explain why you would go with the Bihn bag over the Voyageur in my situation? I've seen the reviews of both on here, but anything specific in light of what I have described?
April 2, 2013 |
JJ
JJ
The Voyageur has an internal frame and a extensive backpack system--neither of which is something I think is necessary for a light travel bag. Others may think those are two of the most important things.
Let's look at the ways you said you'd be traveling:
1) Once a year to Europe to one destination. How long is the bag really going to be on your back?
2) To Africa. Remote? How remote? Will you have to trek through brush to reach her or will you use some type of vehicle?
3) Camping. Okay, I admit I forgot this one. I don't camp so it never comes to mind.
Like I said, for you the Voyageur might be the right one. For me it wouldn't. What I want from a bag may be different than what you want from a bag even in the same scenarios.
Let's look at the ways you said you'd be traveling:
1) Once a year to Europe to one destination. How long is the bag really going to be on your back?
2) To Africa. Remote? How remote? Will you have to trek through brush to reach her or will you use some type of vehicle?
3) Camping. Okay, I admit I forgot this one. I don't camp so it never comes to mind.
Like I said, for you the Voyageur might be the right one. For me it wouldn't. What I want from a bag may be different than what you want from a bag even in the same scenarios.
April 2, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
I appreciate the input. To clarify, when in Europe I have 2 or 3 round trips on trains or jets of various sizes. They haven't involved European discount carriers yet but someday might. That is why I was concerned about the more restrictive carry on dimensions. Regarding Africa, I can't be certain yet. She will probably be reachable by vehicle, but I would value the flexibility to carry 2 or 3 ways. And I would value durability because I've sometimes taken work group trips to places like India or Africa where the bags get tossed around, on luggage carriers on top of busses, etc. I realize I didn't mention that part before.
JJ
JJ
April 2, 2013 |
JJ
JJ
I'm sorry I mentioned Tom Bihn because that is just confusing you more.
Have you read my essay on how to choose a bag? If not, spend a few minutes doing so:
http://www.1bag1world.com/blog/2012/5/13/how-to-series-step-three-choosing-a-bag.html
Please realize this, there is no such thing as the perfect bag. No one bag will fit all of your requirements. Make a list of the two or three things that are most important and go with that.
Have you read my essay on how to choose a bag? If not, spend a few minutes doing so:
http://www.1bag1world.com/blog/2012/5/13/how-to-series-step-three-choosing-a-bag.html
Please realize this, there is no such thing as the perfect bag. No one bag will fit all of your requirements. Make a list of the two or three things that are most important and go with that.
April 2, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
I understand. Thanks again for your help. I have learned a lot on this site. JJ
April 2, 2013 |
JJ
JJ
I disagree Frank. :) Now that JJ has access to some other EDC-type bags, I think the Aeronaut should definitely be in contention. It is such a versatile bag and IMO definitely worth the money.
April 4, 2013 |
JL
JL
I agree with you JL. I think the Aeronaut is the best bag for the situation and the one I would choose. (And it's the main bag I travel with.)
However, JJ seems to be set on the idea that RedOxx and MEI are tougher bags when in reality all them would hold up.
The RedOxx and MEI and made of the same 1000 Codura nylon. The Aeronuat is made of 1050 ballistic nylon. Codura is known to be better at abrasion resistance while ballistic is better at tear resistance. However, both materials are so strong I personally wouldn't worry about either.
From the Tom Bihn website forum alone, there have been customers who traveled with their Aeronaut in every situation JJ mentioned. But Redoxx does the best job at marketing themselves as "jungle" ready. The Voyageur with it's internal frame and overdeveloped backpack system is probably the best for anyone planning to do long distance walking but could be troublesome on airlines with restrictive sizing.
But at the end of the day it's all about personal preference. I could walk into a chocolate shop with someone who is set on getting Swiss chocolate, while I might think Belgian chocolate is better. I could try my best to convince them to try Belgian, but it they want Swiss, that's what they should get. Either way, we both walk out with smiles on our faces because we got what we wanted.
It's all personal preference.
However, JJ seems to be set on the idea that RedOxx and MEI are tougher bags when in reality all them would hold up.
The RedOxx and MEI and made of the same 1000 Codura nylon. The Aeronuat is made of 1050 ballistic nylon. Codura is known to be better at abrasion resistance while ballistic is better at tear resistance. However, both materials are so strong I personally wouldn't worry about either.
From the Tom Bihn website forum alone, there have been customers who traveled with their Aeronaut in every situation JJ mentioned. But Redoxx does the best job at marketing themselves as "jungle" ready. The Voyageur with it's internal frame and overdeveloped backpack system is probably the best for anyone planning to do long distance walking but could be troublesome on airlines with restrictive sizing.
But at the end of the day it's all about personal preference. I could walk into a chocolate shop with someone who is set on getting Swiss chocolate, while I might think Belgian chocolate is better. I could try my best to convince them to try Belgian, but it they want Swiss, that's what they should get. Either way, we both walk out with smiles on our faces because we got what we wanted.
It's all personal preference.
April 4, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
I'm not making assumptions regarding which bag is tougher or which of the 3 companies make tougher bags. Some folks in this forum have used all these, when i am not sure i have even seen ant of them. i came here so I could make a more informed choice, not to reinforce my assumptions.
I believe I noted this earlier, but my interest in Red Oxx is largely influenced by the "any time, any reason" warranty; I am not assuming this makes the bags better, only that my investment is better protected in instances where I have no choice but to let someone handle my bag (and thus damage uncovered by the other warranties). I understand perceptions are shaped by marketing, etc. which is part of why I came here in the first place.
My interest in MEI relative to Bihn is partly about lower cost and same warranty. And since I don't know all the ways I might use the bag, the internal frame seems worth considering.
My uncertainty regarding bag design (compartments especially) largely comes from uncertainty regarding how often or for how much longer I will need to travel with a laptop.
I am well aware that bag choices are about personal preferences. I came here for input that would help me determine those preferences and both the site in general and this thread in particular have helped with that. I'll take another look at the Bihn bag in light of your most recent post.
I would love to buy both kinds of chocolate, but I can only afford one and I don't live in a location that makes it easy to sample either.
I believe I noted this earlier, but my interest in Red Oxx is largely influenced by the "any time, any reason" warranty; I am not assuming this makes the bags better, only that my investment is better protected in instances where I have no choice but to let someone handle my bag (and thus damage uncovered by the other warranties). I understand perceptions are shaped by marketing, etc. which is part of why I came here in the first place.
My interest in MEI relative to Bihn is partly about lower cost and same warranty. And since I don't know all the ways I might use the bag, the internal frame seems worth considering.
My uncertainty regarding bag design (compartments especially) largely comes from uncertainty regarding how often or for how much longer I will need to travel with a laptop.
I am well aware that bag choices are about personal preferences. I came here for input that would help me determine those preferences and both the site in general and this thread in particular have helped with that. I'll take another look at the Bihn bag in light of your most recent post.
I would love to buy both kinds of chocolate, but I can only afford one and I don't live in a location that makes it easy to sample either.
April 4, 2013 |
JJ
JJ
Let's talk about a few things:
1) Damage to the bag---these bags are very tough. It's going to take a lot to truly damage any of them. While Redoxx has the best warranty, the Sky Train was designed for carry-on air/train travel and not adventure travel. The backpacks offered are not going to be comfortable for long and the lack of either waist belt of sternum strap means all the load is on your shoulder. It's also the heaviest of the bags and if you start to fly air carriers that weigh carry-on bags, every ounce helps.
2) Cost--no question, the Voyageur is the winner and by quite a bit. The Voyageur is an excellent, versatile bag with a comfortable backpack system, external commpression straps and frame. If you plan to do quite of bit of carrying on your back, then this is the way to go.
3) Versatility--the Aeronaut is somewhere in the middle. Buying one with the optional waist belt means you get a comfortable backpack system that will handle most duty, a well designed bag that can carry a little or a lot, and a hybrid between a one and three compartment bag.
(Whichever bag you choose, I'm going to suggest you get the Tom Bihn Absolute Strap. It is, hands down, the best shoulder strap I've ever used. )
Lastly, let me point something out. All three companies, at least I know RedOxx and Tom Bihn will do this, will allow you to return an unused bag for a full refund. You pay shippintg. So, you could get one, and if you really hated it, return it and get your money back. .
1) Damage to the bag---these bags are very tough. It's going to take a lot to truly damage any of them. While Redoxx has the best warranty, the Sky Train was designed for carry-on air/train travel and not adventure travel. The backpacks offered are not going to be comfortable for long and the lack of either waist belt of sternum strap means all the load is on your shoulder. It's also the heaviest of the bags and if you start to fly air carriers that weigh carry-on bags, every ounce helps.
2) Cost--no question, the Voyageur is the winner and by quite a bit. The Voyageur is an excellent, versatile bag with a comfortable backpack system, external commpression straps and frame. If you plan to do quite of bit of carrying on your back, then this is the way to go.
3) Versatility--the Aeronaut is somewhere in the middle. Buying one with the optional waist belt means you get a comfortable backpack system that will handle most duty, a well designed bag that can carry a little or a lot, and a hybrid between a one and three compartment bag.
(Whichever bag you choose, I'm going to suggest you get the Tom Bihn Absolute Strap. It is, hands down, the best shoulder strap I've ever used. )
Lastly, let me point something out. All three companies, at least I know RedOxx and Tom Bihn will do this, will allow you to return an unused bag for a full refund. You pay shippintg. So, you could get one, and if you really hated it, return it and get your money back. .
April 4, 2013 |
Frank@OBOW
Frank@OBOW
1. I bike commute an approximately 10 miile rt when the weather is decent. I'm a college professor, so I only need to carry an iPad and a few books, plus workout clothes (including shoes). Or, alternatively, wear the workout clothes ad pack business casual (incl shoes). However, I would want to use the same bag for getting to and from classes, which would not usually involve a 15 inch laptop but might occasionally do so.
2. I teach for a month in Europe each summer, but have access to laundry facilities and thus only take 3 changes of clothes and 2 prs shoes (running and business casual). My tech needs are minimal (can probably get away with just iPad and charger though have previously taken laptop, I can thus fit eeverything in a carry on bag and want to get something that can fit within the more restrictive European regulations.
3. My daughter is moving to a pretty remote part of Africa in a couple of years, so it would be nice to pack more than the Europe trips require. So I would liek something that can expand beyond the needs preiously noted and durable enough to check in if those trips require an abandonment of the carry on preference I have.
4. We take short camping trips, so I would like to use this as my personal bag. Not a hiking backpack, just rugged enough and water resistent enough to use for that purpose.
My highest priorities are durability and flexibility, with a very strong preference for being able to meet any global carry on requirements. And I want this bag to last for life, so the Red Oxx warrantly has particular appeal.
I love the durability of the Air Boss, but it seems to me that back pack straps are a virtual necessity in this scenario. Unless Red Oxx decides to put back pack straps on the Air Boss (and quality and ergo ones at that), I've got to look elsewhere (it seems to me). Therefore, these are the options I am currently considering:
1. SkyTrain--love the durability and warrantly, but back pack straps are underwhelming to some reviewers.
2. MEI Overnighter--probably my front runner at the moment. Having trouble finding out if I simply need something well made (which all agree it is) or overbuilt (as Air Boss and SkyTrain appear to be). The warranty on the Red Oxx stuff reallly appeals, because I love the idea of getting 25 years of this kind of use out of this kind of bag. What are the chances the MEI EO will withstand this? Haven't been able to easily find out warranty specifics. Probably just need to contact them, I know, but would like to find out of warranty covers only manufacturing defects or is as comprehensive as Red Oxx.
3. Tri Star. I am really interested in this one too, but noticed some reviews talking about the rubber coming off around the zippers. Don't know how big of an issue this is. Would prefer one of the other cheaper (though in the case of SkyTrain only slightly cheaper) options, but if I can get 25 years out of the bag, I can't really complain about the additional cost.
I should have added that it is not especially important for my bag to look professional in a "goes with a suit" kind of way. It would be helpful to have something that looks appropriate in a business casual environment, though. No need to pack a suit; if I ever need it, I wear it.
What would you do, and why? Are there other options I should be considering but am not? Are there other issues I need to think through in order to make a good decision? I've gained much insight from this forum; know that any insights you can provide will be greatly appreicated. I know this is asking a lot out of one bag and that my goal may be unrealistic. It is what I am shooting for, though.